I've been in this program for over half a year, and watched the videos multiple times. John looked at my squeeze page and apparently I'm doing everything wrong. And I don't know how I'm doing it wrong or how to do it right. After all this time and all the hours I've put into it I'm no farther along than before I started. How do I learn this stuff? I can't find a clear and concise method of going through this material in a way that creates a positive outcome. I feel like I'm constantly on square one and can't find the information to get off it. And when I think I've got it I discover I'm still doing it all wrong.
As of right now:
I haven't been able to get any subscribers
My squeeze page is no longer working
I don't have a clue how to make effective ads or squeeze pages (I've watched the videos in regards to this over four times).
I'm not even sure what my next (first) step should be.
Anyone who can offer any guidance, I'd greatly appreciate it.
Twang!
Jimi
Hi Jimi,
As we spoke about in the recent coaching call, there are many aspects of what I looked at yesterday that were not quite in line with what is laid out in MMM. That said, everything can be addressed and improved.
That said, the way you have expressed yourself in this post is very broad. Per what we discussed in the call, can you post a link to your squeeze page and also post a screenshot of your Aweber web form stats, and list out your exact targeting (all interests and demographic settings of your ad with the most spend) so I can start to get a sense of what has been done and where some of the first problems might lie? This is also important so others can understand and learn as well.
It's quite difficult to address a question as broad as nothing is working, what should I do? But if we break it down into smaller chunks we can go through all potential issues one item at a time.
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Yes, but until your reply I didn't ven know what chunks to break it into.
Here's the page:
http://coincidencemachine.org/promo-1/
I'm not using Aweber, I'm using Mailchimp. I'm not sure what "web form stats" are, or where to find them.
I was targeting Nassau County, NY, 22-60 y/o and using these interests:
I spent $66.93 and got one subscriber before terminating the ad. It ran for about a week.
Let me know what other information you need or where I should start as far as creating results.
Thanks a bunch,
Jimi
Oh, ad what was the lesson on copy writing?
Hi Jimi,
"Web form stats" are something that is referred to a lot in the MMM course as they are the key metric to monitor. A web form is the actual opt in form that you would place on your squeeze page (or any other web page). Stats are self explanatory. In order to see exactly how something is performing I need to see the web form stats. Often I can see things on that stats page that are not apparent when discussing stats. You should be able to see the number of unique impressions and the number of conversions, as well as a few other things. Per MMM each squeeze page should have its own web form so stats can be monitored separately from what might display on the home page.
Not having those at the moment I can comment on what I can see and what you have mentioned above. Here are some notes as I just go through what you have provided.
To be totally honest I feel that there are a lot of things here that are not consistent with what is laid out in MMM. You may benefit from going back over the course. There are a lot of nuances discussed throughout the material, many of which are not in place just yet.
A few IC lessons you may benefit from are:
Squeeze Page Headline Bootcamp
Hope that helps. Good luck with everything.
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Thanks for the links and the advice. Steve is trying to help me figure out how to get the opt-in link happening again (the guy I paid to do it solved the issue by changing it from a squeeze page).
I couldn't figure out how to get the text to align left w/out it moving the photo above or below the text. After a couple hours at it, I just went with this. Is there a simple way of learning how to get it to align left? (When I first made the page I followed along w/ your video, but for whatever reason when I do this it often doesn't turn out for me like it does for you).
As to the photo: I've had a lot of photos evaluated, and basically every time my face is clearly visible the photos score very low, but picture w/out my face (like the one used) score much higher on all metrics. And these are all professionally taken photos.
Once I've got the page sorted I can implement your other advice.
Thanks,
Twang!
Oh, and I forgot: you asked about web stats. I understand that those are important, I don't know how to access that information. Where do I go for that?
Thanks,
Twang!
Hey Jimi,
he opt in form is added to the squeeze page by adding a custom field. You will find clear instructions in MMM and you definitely shouldn't need assistance from anyone else. Just watch the video and follow the steps. You basically scroll down in the page editor to custom fields, create one called opt-in and add your code. But do watch the video to insure you do it correctly.
As for adjusting the image with the text, you can find this in MMM. It is finicky but all you need to do is play with the image and font sizes until they line up. Go back through the relevant lesson in MMM.
As for the photo: I'm assuming by "evaluated" you mean that you got opinions from people as to which photo was best. What people say and what they do are very inconsistent. I would never go off of stated opinions. I would only go off of conversion results. I can certainly be wrong about these things, but I am pretty confident that this image will work slightly against you for the reasons stated in the last post. I can't really see your face and I don't get a sense of who you are which is key. Again, it's not a bad image. It just obscures your brand and identity a bit. That's what my gut tells me anyway. Definitely something to test by running traffic to different versions of the page at the very least.
Re web stats: In MMM I show you how to retrieve them from Aweber. I wouldn't be able to offer support for other services that I don't use. You would need to contact Mailchimp and explain what you are looking for and ask where you can find the equivalent.
Hope that helps.
All the best.
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Maybe I should've made this clear: I did follow along w/ the MMM videos when I did the above. But when I do the steps you do in the order you do, I don't get the same results. I don't know why that's happening, and I'm hoping Steve (or someone at MMM) can help me get it sorted.
I didn't use people I know for the photo opinions, I used site like Photofeeler that test photos for such things. My face never gets good results, over the course of a survey, not a handful of people.
I'll check w/ Mailchimp about webstats (but at least now I know where to go).
Here's some headline ideas I came up w/ using your exercise. Am I on the right track?
Do you wish artists still combined virtuosity with songwriting that took you on a journey?
Do you hate having your music dumbed-down? Want some of the creativity that defined the golden age of progressive rock?
If you're tired of dumbed-down songwriting, and miss the kind of journey that progressive rock and fusion used to provide....
Nostalgic for the progressive rock and fusion of the 70s?
Thanks for your assistance.
Twang!
Hi Jimi,
I would not go off of a site like Photofeeler to determine what will perform best on a squeeze page. It's an interesting approach, but there is not necessarily a correlation between what people say they like and what actually motivates them. If I surveyed 100 people and asked them if they liked my squeeze page or my "official" web site better, they would get nearly 10% of the people saying they liked my "official" website. And yet that site converts at about 4% while my squeeze page converts at about 25%. I would always test the images in the context of running traffic. The simplest way of going about it would be to split test three different images in an ad and use the best performer in your ad, as well as on your squeeze page. At least as a starting place. It may be that you haven't got the perfect photo of your face just yet (I haven't seen them) but they really do usually perform best.
I'm not sure what you mean by "But when I do the steps you do in the order you do, I don’t get the same results". I understand that you have gone through the videos at some point, but I can see by how many things are inconsistent with the course that you have missed some steps, so my advice would be to go through things again. If followed, things will line up. Particularly when it comes to creating the site. If something doesn't line up you can either post or email that specific item and we can explain why. But we need to get very specific in order to diagnose and advise.
I think you are on the right track with your approach to the headline. I'm not sure you have the perfect phrasing just yet but you're tapping into something that I assume bugs you about modern music, and as such it might also connect with other fans of progressive rock.
The headline I liked the best was "Do you hate having your music dumbed-down? Want some of the creativity that defined the golden age of progressive rock?" I'd probably try to distill that into a bit of a statement and try to relate it to something more specific.
Something like, "If you're tired of all the dumbed-down modern music and miss the (describe the sound) Golden Age of Progressive Rock then Grab the Latest Single From "Coincidence Machine" - Free!"
I'm not saying the above is amazing or will do well, but I'd try to frame your ideas into statements like that. But ising questions in the ad can be a good way to go.
My biggest concern is Progressive Rock as a targeting option. I think it's too broad and means different things to different people. It's actually an example of a targeting option that I have seen fail many times. I would try to niche down a bit more or relate your claims to a sound or artist that has a more universal connotation and will play into your targeting.
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I am working w/ Steve on the specifics of getting the page working, but for your own info, there is a place where you type in a "custom field" but on my page it only lets me choose from a drop down menu. The steps in the video aren't available to me in reality.
As for the headline: dumbing down doesn't bug ME about music, it's more of something I've overheard other folk say and so I thought it might be an option (and when I was brainstorming these I didn't throw out any ideas). We do throw some punk, blues, and country stuff in our sets, so bearing that in mind, is it still a good option?
If it is, how about “If you’re tired of all the dumbed-down modern music and miss the adventurous abandon of King Drimson, Frank Zappa, and others from the Golden Age of Progressive Rock then Grab the Latest Single From “Coincidence Machine” – Free!”
Should I not use the term "Progressive Rock" in the above (based on what you've said)? Should I market more toward Fusion? (I expect not, but I don't really feel I know anything about marketing as of yet)
Thanks a bunch!
Twang!
Hi Jimi,
The steps in the corresponding MMM lesson do lign up with how to create the custom field and add the code. I'd suggest going over the video lesson again. If you are still confused then take a screenshot of your screen in the instance that you do not feel it lines up and email it in. That way we can better explain which items you might be overlooking.
That headline is not a bad start. the artists might be a bit varied which makes it less clear who the message is for though. That would be my biggest concern. For example, I am a Frank Zappa fan but not a King Crimson fan, and not really a fan of progressive rock (at least as I define it). When I think of progressive rock I think of bands like Rush. And while Frank Zappa is enormously technical, his spirit (and in my opinion, the reason his music exists) is totally different than the average progressive rock band. That;s just my perspective, and I'm not at all debating the band or the term progressive rock, I'm just trying to point out how a reader could find clashing concepts in a headline like that and be turned off just as quickly as they became interested.
Targeting things like Punk, Blues, etc, would be equally as broad and not likely get good results. Whatever audience you target you need to show them that your music will deliver the EXACT qualities they consciously appreciate. You show them this with your choice of words and spirit in your headline, your image, your quotes, and every other little aspect of your presentation.
This is why it's also important that you target a single audience with a precise message.
In instances where you are targeting local and the audience is too small you need to view the "locality" as the target audience and speak to them on that level, and then potentially just use a bunch of artists to narrow the audience down a bit rather than aim to try and speak to fans of 30 different artists about the specifics of the genre.
Hope that helps.
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So are you saying I shouldn't use other artist names at all? Or is there a specific way to use them?
Likewise w/ genres, should I not put them in headlines at all or is there a way they should be used that I'm not doing (in which case, what is the way they should be used)?
Thanks again,
Twang!
Hi Jimi,
No, I'm saying that you are using keywords in your headline (in this case the artists, and the genre) that can represent very different things to different people and as such, throw the effectiveness of your ad off and create a disconnect.
For example, (just to make a silly example in which the point will hopefully be clearer) let's say that I owned a pet store and sold fish, birds, dogs, cats, etc...
If I ran an ad to fish lovers saying "come on down to John's Pet World and get some of the most beautiful Angel fish, parakeets, and dalmatians you've ever scene", I might do okay and attract some fish hobbyists down to the store. But more likely I would alienate too many of those fish keepers who got the impression that I did not specialize in what they were most excited about. While I might not alienate all of them, I'd probably alienate enough of them to make the ad run at a loss. But if I only targeted fish owners and told them to "come on down to John's Pet World and see our new shipment of Angelfish that all come from a Grand Champion Line, limit one pair per customer", I might really tap into some serious fish nerdery and get much better results.
Better yet, if I targeted Angelfish owners I'd do even better.
The point is that there are no specific rules about this will work or that will work, beyond the fact that you need to hone in on your ideal fan, understand what excites them, and understand how you have that exact quality. then simply show them and offer a link.
Hope that helps.
Having trouble with your marketing? Wish you could have an experienced direct-to-fan marketing expert look over your actual campaigns, music, or content and offer feedback? Or perhaps you’re just looking for a little one-on-one assistance so you can ask questions that pertain to your specific goals and get a second, more experienced, perspective? Click here to book a session with me now.
That does help.
How do I "hone in on your ideal fan, understand what excites them"? I think that's the [art I'm missing.
Thanks again,
Twang!
I would start by watching the copywriting shortcuts lesson that I linked to initially. And while it's a 5 year old lesson, this one might help a bit as well.
Brand creation (and as such, audience identification) is so personalized that it's not something that someone else can precisely teach any more than I can tell you what you should write about in your songs. I can give you exercises that will help you get in the right mindset, help you recognize, and distill your ideas, but I can't tell you what your brand is or who your fans ultimately are.
For most people it's reasonably intuitive. But not for everyone. In cases where a person is not as clear on their brand or their audience, they are left with testing. To test you would set up multiple ad sets and multiple squeeze pages trying different approaches until you stumble into something that works, and then refine from there. But you will spend much less time and money if you have some concrete sense of who you are as an artist and who you are ultimately making the music for.
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This was very helpful, especially as I wouldn't have intuited this on my own since it's the opposite of how I look for music.
Here's what I've got for a headline:
Do you miss the adventurousness of a group like King Crimson? Wish you could find a modern group with music of that depth which takes you on a journey? Well, you just have.
If this is good, I was thinking I could change the group name and split test them. AM I doing this right?
Thanks,
Twang!
Awesome. Glad this thread is helping.
I hate to say it but I still think that is a bit clunky.
I think you're getting closer, but it's a bit long, and it doesn't flow like a natural conversation just yet.
I'm not really sure what 'adventurousness" means on a sonic level. Think you can hone in on that quality a bit more?
I also personally tend to use at least two band names (when I use them at all) so that no one can accuse me of just piggybacking on their brand. But that's just me. However that gets us back into the last problem. You need to be pretty sure you won't alienate one audience by mentioning another. That said, this second point is less important than the first one. Smooth out the language and then you can always try it with a single artist just to see what happens.
But right now I don't really get any sense of what you sound like or represent based on the headline as it stands. I just kind of think... what is adventurous music? Not trying to be funny there. That's just actually my thought process.
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So how do I learn to do that? I feel like it's the whole "talking about music is like dancing about architecture" thing. Is there a video where you teach how to turn a sound into words?
Thanks again,
Jimi
Hi Jimi,
Yes, I've referenced them several times in this thread.
A few IC lessons you may benefit from are:
Squeeze Page Headline Bootcamp
Hope that helps.
Having trouble with your marketing? Wish you could have an experienced direct-to-fan marketing expert look over your actual campaigns, music, or content and offer feedback? Or perhaps you’re just looking for a little one-on-one assistance so you can ask questions that pertain to your specific goals and get a second, more experienced, perspective? Click here to book a session with me now.
So I've watched all those videos again, but I'm not finding anything that shows how to give the reader an idea of what the music sounds like other than comparing it to other bands (honestly, the headlines you use as examples don't give me a sense of what the music sounds like). I'm not saying this to be critical, but to point out that I'm not understanding something, and I don't even know what it is that I'm not understanding (which makes this very frustrating).
Thanks for your help,
Twang!